Untitled - February 17, 2026
00:00:00 Speaker: It's always nice to have someone's voice in the back of your head when you're making parental decisions. And one voice that I'd love to keep in the back of my mind is Penny Ibbotson, who is today's guest on the Working Moms Redefined podcast. Penny is a now retired therapist and mother of three beautiful daughters who teaches us how to not only make healthy decisions as parents, but help bring up our kids in confidence and clarity to be good leaders. And if you're watching on our YouTube channel right now, you're watching Penny being like, oh, do I really do that? Absolutely. You really do that. Penny. Penny, welcome. Thanks for being here. Thank you for the kind words. And thank you for inviting me, I appreciate it. I look forward to this time together. Yes. And that being said, as we really kind of set some time aside to invest into our parenting skills, if you will, what is it that you hope that listeners take away by the end of our podcast episode? Enjoy parenting. Gosh darn it, that is exactly what I needed to hear. Enjoy parenting. Why, Penny, is it so important that we actually enjoy getting to be parents? Why should we do that? Wow. It's so layered of an answer. I think it's because you get to be the person that's influencing this little human, which is awesome. And even though my kiddos are no longer little, they're now adult. You're still influencing them. And so that's just like an amazing responsibility. But at the same time, it's kind of fun watching them do their thing and their brains grow and who they are, their personalities grow and everything like that. Um, because you're on the adventure with them. That's why this is an adventure you're on together and you're just kind of like walking side by side. Especially now that my kids are in their twenties. You're just kind of walking side by side, whereas Is when they're younger. You're just kind of like pulling them and guiding them and shoving and holding them back if you have to at times, which you try not to do, but it's just an adventure you're on together. I think life is an adventure. You're supposed to enjoy it. That's my view. I mean, it's only rainbows and skills, but at the same time, I really do think it is rainbows and Skittles, even though it's a lot of work. But you learn so much about yourself as you're doing it, if you're willing to. I feel so much emotion in my chest as I hear you say that, because fun is something that I don't give myself enough credit for. There was a woman in her mid sixties that said to me when I was a very young parent, man, I bet you are just such a fun mom. And that has stuck with me because I don't always believe it. Just this week, I was then the mom that stopped to jump rope in the middle of the living room with these kids because they're doing jump rope for heart, right? And then I peed myself because my pelvic floor therapist needs to come back into my life. Yes. Good for you. And you just stopped everything. You stopped being an adult. Just be at your children's level of love and excitement and energy, because that's something they were very invested in. And you took a moment to get into what they're invested in. And it was fun. How often should we be doing this? Of course, you know me well enough through previous conversations that we've gotten to live life together, and it's like one. Denise, stop measuring everything. Like, stop having a to do list for fun. And two. Yet how do I know if I'm doing a good enough job? Because I want to be where my feet are and I'm in a jump rope for, like, eight minutes. And then I said, okay, now I need to go finish dinner if you guys would like to eat. And there was still a little bit of guilt there like you. How dare you want to leave these children who are playing to go feed them? You know what I mean? Like, as I say this out loud, it's that mom guilt that so many of us talk about. And Penny is raising her eyebrows. If you're watching on YouTube to say you just are coaching yourself through this, Denise. But how do how do we find, I guess, enough joy in ourselves to realize that both are okay to live in the same moment? Yes, because it's not like you did not do it. You did do it. But you also modeled responsibility and you modeled, you know, I have to go do this, which is teaching them how to balance life. And so, yes, let me stop everything and enjoy being with you and jump rope and. ET cetera, et cetera. But now I have to go do this, because that is life. I mean, even your kiddos, they're balancing activities with school, school, with home, home responsibilities. And so you just modeled it. And so it's just like you have to think about, you're saying you feel guilty, but this is a you thing. You're projecting that onto you. You're putting that on to you. And really, it's not about you in that moment. It's about. But what did you do for your kiddos? You did do a lot for your kiddos. You're still just doing for them by going over here and fixing them supper. You know, so I think that it's it's about you, but you also have to take a moment to step out of it because you still did everything that you're expecting yourself to do. Did that make sense? One hundred percent, because I've used the phrase more oftentimes than not that it's not about me or whomever in that situation, but that's always when it benefits the other person. How dare I, penny apply that when it would actually benefit me? Yes, yes. Gives us that outsider's perspective to say, you're right. It is about this holistic approach and looking at it from a third person's view almost. And as you said, modeling responsibility with still having fun in parenting. We went head strong first. Right out the gate. Penny. Well done. I think we tend to do this when we have conversations. But yes, you did it. You you you. But it's kind of like what I said earlier about you walk parallel with your kids. I mean, I said, I'm doing that more now since my kids are in their twenties and I'm no longer front line parenting. But the reality is what you just did was parallel parent. I mean, you're you're walking side by side with your kid. That's not parallel parent. You're you're walking side by side. You have to do this. And he and he or she has to do this and you're just walking side by side. And that's okay. You're still being a parent. You're an amazing parent. Thank you I appreciate that. Sydney is now nine and Hudson is seven. And so we are in full responsibility, like helping them grow to be good leaders. And Penny, that is something that you help a lot of parents do. First question of this is what would you say to raise good leaders are three to five of the biggest qualities that you really encourage or help others realize the importance of when it comes to, dare I say, teaching leadership. Okay, I'm not sure if I'll get three to five, but I'm just going to rattle because this is the way I roll. Um, I would say growing leaders within your children, creating leadership within your children. I think that starts. I'm going to contradict myself. It's about you a little bit. That is about you, because you have to model that for them. So how else are they going to learn unless they see you doing it? So I think we are in such an amazing community here. It's a smaller community that more things are underneath a microscope, perhaps, but at the same time, I think it's really lovely because you can be involved in so many different things. And I think from my perspective as a parent, which is easier for me to talk about because I don't have to worry about confidentiality. But me as a therapist, I have to worry about confidentiality. But for us as parents, we do believe that we modeled leadership. We got involved in different activities. We were involved in school stuff and even stuff outside of our kiddos. We were involved in community projects in this area, and I think you model that leadership, and I think that's one because your kids no different than if they're watching TV and they they start emulating what they see. They do that with us too. And I think it's important to model what we're wanting them to look like or what we're wanting them to morph into as they grow and become adults. So I think that that's the first one that it is about you in that regards, that we set that tone and that kind of that, that environment that we are involved and we are leaders in different ways. That's my first one. It there's a little there's the joking side of me that's like, oh, is so is that why Hudson is as sassy as he is is because that's me. It's because I'm modeling that from time to time. Oh, it's like putting up a mirror. Which is fine. There's nothing wrong with being a little sassy. You just don't like when it comes at you. Boom, boom. And that's okay. I think that's fine. I think that's fine. Yeah. What qualities really stick out to you after we look at role modeling as parents? I think being a good listener. Mhm. I think especially now we're in a society where everybody's talking, but I don't think we're spending enough time to listen. And you grow if you listen you understand more. If you listen you teach more when you're listening. Sometimes by saying nothing I'm teaching a ton. Um, just to give this as an example, it's a funny example, but, um, when the kids were younger, a storm was coming through and it was a bad one. And what do you do when the storms come through? You got to go to the basement. And our basement was not a lovely basement. It was just a high quality step above a cellar, you know. So it was equipped with all kinds of little creatures, like spiders and stuff like that. It was just an old house. That's just the way it goes. And I, um, took the kids downstairs, and, of course, not uncommon. Where do you think the husband was at? Watching the storm outside. Watching the storm. And and I kind of kept it all together. And I was just, like, very strong and confident for my children and trying to be this great leader and just, like, presenting poise and just like, we got this, we got this. And as my kids got older, they they got onto me. And one of them said, this is just so funny. She said, mom, is this where you are not convinced that we're all okay, but you want us to believe it? Uh, yes. That's exactly what we're doing, and we're going to do it together. And so I think with that is to some degree humility is that you don't have it all together all the time, but you do the best that you can. And I think that that's so much of the leadership is that as a leader, you think you have to be at the top of the pyramid and be all knowing. And the reality is you're not. And so teaching your kids to listen, to express themselves. I think that those and to be honest, I think those are big pieces about being a leader as well, but also just being a person. Yeah, listening to learn rather than to respond is something that I really like to keep in mind, but it made me think of a morning I can't remember if it was today or yesterday, but. Hudson was not moving along as quickly as I thought that he needed to be, and as I came into his room, I unintentionally assumed that he was not getting dressed. Why? Because previous encounters would prove that statement to be true. However, I went in a little hot and I said, Hudson, why are you not? And as I say that he is sitting on his bed. I was going to say, why are you not getting your shirt on? And I saw he was putting his socks on. And so at that moment, I needed to humble myself, as you just said. And I sat down next to him and I said, Hudson, I am sorry. I was coming in a little strong because I assumed that you were not getting your shirt on, and instead you were getting your socks on. And I am very sorry. And that isn't hard for me anymore. It used to be. And yet connection happens on the other side of vulnerability. Oh that's good. Yes, that connection happens on the other side of vulnerability. Yes, but you don't say. If. I don't think it's a weakness either. I think you're just being very honest. And guess what? Your kiddo is going to be honest because you're honest. He's going to be honest because obviously the world does not end if you're honest. You know, life just kept rolling. You got the kid out the door. They realized there was no negative from being honest. What are your thoughts on rushing? There are so many articles, if you will, whether their studies or research or just blogs, does it really impact kids in a negative way? I feel as if it does in our home, because then their bodies or the little tiny bodies are kind of like tense and stressed. And then yes, they're like buzzing, if you will, because we are not on schedule. And yet, how do we get them on schedule so that we are not late for most of the time activities of their own? How do we, in those moments of intensity, let's call them? How do we mellow everyone out? Do you have any suggestions or tips for that? Um, yes, those are good questions. I think more aware of what you're trying to do, because we do try to do too much. And I think that's what I understand even more on this side of the front line parenting. Um, it is easy to do too much. It is easy to not have our self put together when it's time to now shuffle the children out the door, you know, because if you're trying to get ready at the same time as they're trying to get ready, it's just chaotic, you know? Um, but I also think when you're not in the moment of that act of active getting out the door and everything, well, you're not doing that. Sit down and problem solve. How do we need to be better at this? What do we need to do? But do it when you're calm and have the kiddo give you examples of what could go better, and then you're going to be very willing to listen to, well, mom, dad, you yell at us too much and you're like, I'm not yelling. You're like, well, there's a good chance maybe I might be a tad bit, but you need to get your tush going, you know? And so I think just take that time when it's not in the heat of the moment to problem solved. What? To make it better. But I also think there's a piece of. Are we sometimes doing too much? You know, and and even though there's great benefits from doing it all, it also comes with a cost. So just being realistic with that. But help your eager kiddos are such a great age. Even if they're younger, they can help problem solve because they know what's going on inside of them. You can try to figure it out, and you're probably pretty spot on, but it's so nice to hear what they have to say. But being able to put down your sword sometimes, if you will, to be able to hear what they think, probably, like I said, putting a mirror up in front. Nonetheless. Such good advice. What might you say, Penny, to moms who have really healthy decision making skills and yet don't always have confidence in themselves and in the decisions that they make? I think that's where you need your people. You need your people. And and once again, personal only because that's all I can really build upon when I'm talking outside of the therapy room is my people would include my husband. I mean, could not parent the way I parented without him. He's he's just as much the co-pilot as I am his co-pilot. But also, we have a village of amazing people, you know, and, um, just getting together with other people and without your children at times or with your children to hear and to receive that validation that, well, one, you're not losing your ever loving mind even though you feel like you are. And secondly, your children are not Satan's pawns. They're just kids trying to figure out life, you know? And you also are not perfect because you two are just trying to figure out life. And I think the more you're around other people who who mirror or who have the similar kind of approach to parenting. You just get that validation that it's it's not anything you get to perfect. It's just something that you get to do. But if you walk with somebody else doing it, it's amazing. I have several really good friends, even now that we still talk about our kids and we're like, oh my gosh, and off we spend, you know? And it's just wonderful. And it doesn't mean you have to walk away with, okay, I'm going to do A, B and C. No you just walk away going, all right okay, I got this, I got this, I got this, even though. And you also have to think you're not screwing your or messing your children up. Now people do mess up their children. I realize that there are some people who just have not figured out how to parent, or maybe it's just something they don't care to do. Those are not the people I'm referring to. If if you have a good heart and you're really, truly invested in being a good parent, there's a pretty good chance you probably are a good parent. A reminder that so many of us, so many of us can hear. I love this next question. Um, mainly. And it stems from the the depths of Hudson wanting to know the why behind everything, which I think I read One time Penny, where it's like the first child is probably a really great reflection of you. The second child is really the child that you wish that you could have been. And there are times where I find myself getting a little envious of man. I wish I had Hudson's resiliency, or I wish that I could have voiced my opinion the way that he does, and not caring so much about what people think. I do see a lot of that in him. And yet here's the question how can parents balance guiding our children to make own decisions and having their own opinions in a strategic, yet kind and Up leveling leadership way. Okay, so I think I love that example of the oldest. I know you said the oldest is what that she's reflective of me as a whole. Okay. And then the second one is more of a version of what you wish you could have been. So I actually think you're probably more that than you realize. And they're just showing it to you because it's just. Yeah, I that's where I got stuck when you said that. So everything you said after that I heard. But I was still stuck on that. I think that you are, that you did don't allow yourself to be that. And I see that in my own children. In fact, the interesting thing is I had a colleague tell me, ironically, something very similar to what you're talking about is that my second child is more me than I let myself be. Knowing your second child, that's not an incorrect statement. I appreciate that you're also saying that about me, I know, I know what you did on my second child. And and each of my, each of our children have so much of us in them. There's just some that it's just, like in your face and there's some that you're like, oh, there it is. Oh, there it is. You know, and and each of our children have so much of my husband in them, in them. And it's just sometimes I'm like, whew, that's gotta be overwhelming because my husband and I come from such a different perspective sometimes I'm very gray, and he's more of a black and white kind of a person, and it's a great marriage. It works. Um, but it is it is interesting that that was something that somebody told me. And boy, does that not make you kind of stop in your tracks going, huh? Well, maybe I need to let myself be more my what I am, you know, and then you see it play out in your other kiddos. So it's not just about my second child. It was just a that was just that moment because I was spinning and I was like, wow, what do I do with this child? You know, like, do you realize like I do now. Thank you. Was thinking that I do now. My hands are sweaty. Penny. And I think it's because of, like, giving yourself permission. And that, I don't know, ability to not feel like you're not doing what you wish that you could. I was very cool. Yes, that was good. You should be writing this down. But I think that's part of us growing. We're growing with our kiddos. We're growing. I think there's so much to be said about. We focus on children's developmental stages and we go to the doctor. They tell you this kid should be doing this by three and ten and twelve and blah, blah, blah blah. Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful. You don't stop developing you. You develop until the moment you leave this earth physically, you know, and I think that that's part of maybe being somewhat humble too, is that you're growing as you're raising your children. They just happen to be growing quicker and you're responsible for them. I love that for us. So with that thought in mind, how do we allow children to form and have their own opinions that might be different than us? And yet, I think it might go back to that humble stage that we need to operate out of. But how do we, I guess, maybe even empower kids to have opinions that are different than our own? I think you have family conversations. You have one on one conversations with your kiddos. You have conversations with you and your children. Your spouse has conversations just with you and your children, and you allow them to express themselves. You allow them to tell you what you're thinking, and even if sometimes you are gasping of like, what in the world are you thinking? You know, you still once again, it's not about you. It's just like you kind of keep it under control and you, you guide them through whatever they're thinking and feeling. But I also think it's important. I think sometimes parents jump to conclusions when a kid says something, you know, sometimes you just kind of have to just they're just battling. Sometimes they're just talking. And their thoughts are not solid concrete yet, like they are for us. And so just because a kiddo says, you know, I want to, I'm totally winging this. I want to be the president of the United States. Okay, you can sit there and go, well, there's no chance that's going to happen, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you might really feel that. Or maybe they want to be the next NBA basketball player. I don't know, whatever. Whatever. You don't kill their dreams. You just listen to it. You just listen. But I think there are expectations, morals and values that you get to lay down in your home. You know and and doesn't mean everybody else has to adhere by those in other homes. It's just that your home, these are values, these are morals, these are expectations. And if you don't do them, you do have the God given right to tell your children that's not happening. You know, and and so I think when it comes to differences of opinions or is it not acceptable. Those are kind of two different realms in a way. You know, I think they can have their own opinion. They can say, well, I don't like little Johnny in the in the recess because he's a bully, okay. You're entitled to that opinion. You don't get to have an opinion on that one because that's the kids storyline, you know what I mean? So I think it's just kind of like walking that line a little bit of like encouraging the conversation as we talked about earlier and just listening, but then also knowing when you need to kind of draw the boundary of like, so no, that's not happening. I think we have to be competent in parenting. I think, I think we've in in our society as a whole, I think we've almost kind of become scared to parent, and I don't think we need to be scared. Yes, there are those big entities that if they catch you doing something wrong, they're going to take your kid away. Thank God we have those entities, but that's not going to. You don't want that to happen. I'm pretty sure there's a good chance most of us are not going to have that happen, so don't be scared to parent. You are at the top of the pile in that home. Be that parent and teach that child and tell them right from wrong. Such a good practical tool to be able to implement rather quickly. I mean, listening can be something that we can do tomorrow, this afternoon, this evening, tomorrow morning, whatever you want to call it. But what is an emotional skill? That is one that comes to the top for you of something that we can model and or teach for our kids that will benefit them for years to come. I like that question. I really, really, really had a hard time coming up with one. And I don't know if this is an emotional skill. I guess it could be respect. Oh yeah. Would that be an emotional skill? Do you feel like that's an emotional? It could be both, because respect is something that you can feel and yet not see, but then also be modeled. Tell me more about respect for you. I think I think this is a dynamic we dealt with. And I hear this in the therapy sessions of like, um, you know, you have examples of bad choices. You know, I mean, everywhere you go, you see things that are not necessarily good choices or homes that they do things differently. You know, a common one is, well, George gets to stay out till two o'clock in the morning. Well, that's great for George. That's great for their family. But that doesn't mean we're doing it that way, you know. And I think just respecting you don't have to talk negatively about other people. But you can identify that that's not the way we're going to do it. And I just think respect is so important. I don't know I'm not sure if that's the right answer for the question, but that's what came to my mind first is like respecting that there are differences. And but at the same time it's still okay that we do it this way. Mhm. Yeah. I'm actually this is bringing up something from a couple Saturdays ago at a basketball game. Hudson is first grade so obviously we are not on NBA level yet. But that's where a lot of the leadership skills within sports I believe are taught. Now I am not a coach this year. Um, we've talked about control issues of mine in previous episodes, and so letting that go, to let Jeremy shine has been very great, very important. And I lay all of that groundwork to say leadership was not taught at the most recent basketball game. And it is still on my heart. And Jeremy and I have had a conversation about it, and I hope at the next game that it changes, or at least something is done differently. But a lot of the parents, it goes back to your point of saying like, we're not we're kind of scared to parent right now in a little bit. Um, Hudson hauled off and pushed a kid on the other team. Granted, it was the same school, but he pushed a kid. And of course, my voice is so very quiet and timid and weak and so not at all as I'm there on the other side of the court, I am sitting in the bleachers and I said, hey, we don't push. And he looked at me like he'd gotten caught. Which is silly, because why wouldn't he think I was watching? And I said, we on purpose because I'm not going to push anybody. You shouldn't be pushing anybody. And three moms around me said, oh, but he got pushed first. He got pushed. I said, it does not matter. It does not matter because we are not a family that push. Now, granted, are there situations where one day you might have to push? For sure, but nobody, nobody except mom yelling on the other side of the court said anything. And I brought it up to Jeremy and he goes, I know. I said something to him. And I said, you didn't say. And again, I'm critiquing. And Jeremy is okay if I talk about stuff like this because he really doesn't have a choice, you know what I mean? And so he said, well, we talked about it later and I said, but in that moment it did not get corrected. And that is a non-negotiable. But man, it is on my heart because why is it okay to like, why is it okay in today's world that if he got pushed first, that's okay that he pushes second? And that is something that respect is a large part of that. That is an emotional tool that is not was not being applied in that scenario and doing it. Penny, it's I'm still hot and fired about it apparently. No no no no no I think you they did model leadership. It was just not your preferred leadership. Explain more. Talk about humility at our finest. Please tell me more. Because it was leadership, the leadership chose to not address it. It's the leadership. They're still in the leadership role. It is. Don't like it. And that's okay. You don't like it because the learning moment is at that time, the very teachable moment is in that moment. And not just for the kiddo who pushed, but it's for the whole group that we're sending a message that us as not only a family, which is great, but as a team, we don't do this, you know. And I. And the teachable moment was lost. Not just for your son who did it, but for the whole group, as well as all the parents in the stand, because they needed to hear this is not acceptable. But but by saying, well, he was pushed first, it's like a justifying the behaviour. And you're saying, no, it's not justified, you know. But for them that made them feel more comfortable that it was justified. It's not justified. So it's leadership. It's just not your first choice of leadership. I also hear you saying that, and I bet part of them around me were saying that to give me like a it's okay. It's not it's not his fault. Right. But if you know me well enough, I don't need that pat on the back like, you know. And that's okay. But I, you know, as I hear you say that out loud, they were they were trying to comfort me whether they might have been embarrassed in that situation, too. And so great point. Great point. Kenny helps or previously helped. Let's be honest. You still help. You're doing it right now. So many parents better and uplevel our parenting with our kids, and we're so grateful for that. And yet you also lead alongside with so many in our community to help us better understand in a season. Let's be honest, we've never been in this season when it comes to overwhelm or what younger generations are dealing with. And Penny is going to be in Quincy on February twenty seventh. Speaking about that on a panel at Leadership Redefined Blythe and Penny, we are so excited to have you for that, to talk about some dynamics of what we've referred to today and yet how to help us as leaders, seasoned or not, how to show up better for our younger generations. And I think that example was a great way to see both sides of that. And I can't wait to have I can't wait to have you there. Those tickets are available at Denise Talcott's leadership. Com and Penny, like I said, will be there before we leave. Penny. I want to get onto a dynamic that we haven't really gotten to talk a lot about with working moms. Redefined is the sibling relationship, and you help navigate and help bring parents to a positive sibling relationship. And yet sibling conflict is pretty common, but very exhausting. From your experience, what might need to happen so that sibling rivalries. Let's do both a young age and at an older age maybe aren't given so much power in our lives. Um, well, sibling conflicts are normal. They don't have to be rivalry. They can be complex. Okay. I, I if I said it once, I've probably said it a hundred times. Raising children. I want you guys to get along so that I know when it's time for you to decide which nursing home to put me in. I know you guys can make the best decision as a group. Now, I would say that because it is important not just for me, but and and I hope that they don't have I have to worry about that. But it's just telling them this is beyond the moment, you know, because emotions can get so intense in the moment. The reality is you got to get beyond this and you still have to like each other. In the end, when children and siblings have that conflict, I think it's up to the parents to really kind of nurture each child individually and get to know the child's heart and get to know the child's personality. Get to know where they're at as individuals, but also understanding that they are their own group. Because my husband and I were here. These kids are their own group too. And not only do I want to have a lovely relationship with them here, there and everywhere as we go through this life together, I want them to have an amazing relationship because that's who you've always had. That's the one person that will know you from the beginning to the end. You know what I mean? I mean, other than Mom and Dad, but more than likely, parents will not be there at the end of their life. You know, if that makes sense. So, um, I think that getting to know their heart, but recognizing they get to have their own relationship. And then I think another layer is you don't always have to get involved. And this this sounds harsh. And I say this in a very light hearted way, but sometimes I would say y'all figure this out. And so there's bloodshed. I'm not going to do anything. No, that's not true. But sometimes you just have to let them know it's not that serious. You know, I did ask my daughters because I knew some of these thoughts that you were going to throw at me. And I said, you guys, what do you think you know? and only one kiddo was able to respond because of course, I just did it about an hour ago, and the one thing that I had already thought of is you have to teach them problem solving skills, you know? And when raising the kiddos, we have tile squares, the square tiles in our kitchen and it did not matter if you were there each you were my kids, or you were the neighbor kids, or you were having a sleepover when children started to have conflict. And for the record, we have three daughters, so there's a whole lot of emotions, you know, what are we doing? You know, girls are more emotional, tend to be more emotional. Guys tend to be more physical. Although there was always nieces and nephews in our house. But anyway, I would stick their little butts in a tile and they had to sit there until they figured it out, until they problem solved. And I would come in and I'd help guide and kind of give them suggestions, and they would leave and let them figure it out together. And I make this motion because it is. It's this. It's not me coming down to them and solving their problem. It's guiding them on how to solve their problem this way, you know, and and I think that that was so important. And one of my daughters said, mommy, you know, the tiles always solve the problem. I'm like, no, that's that. We're sitting in the tile because they had to sit there until they figured out how to get along. And I think taking time to understand you're not all supposed to be the same. You know, you want to have some similarities because you're the same family, but enjoy the uniqueness of each of your children. And if you enjoy it, then the other kids will enjoy the uniqueness of their sibling, even if it is like totally different than who you are, you know, or who they are. And I think that that's so incredibly important. And another thing that I think I didn't see enough of this at times in therapy, and I would encourage parents to do to do this. And that is, it almost needs to be a requirement that if you're available and your sibling has an activity, you're going into it. You have to show that support. You have to be in the stands supporting your sibling. You don't get to stay home and and and do nothing unless, you know, I shouldn't say across the board nothing. I mean, if you have to have a day off, I get that. But in general, that needs to be the expectation that you're there to build up your sibling. It's not just about you. And I think that that's another big piece of helping the kids to see that they're in this together, you know? And it's kind of funny because now even my kids are, as I said, adults. And and sometimes they'll tell me the conversations that are happening. I'm not part of it. I'm like, wait a minute. Oh, wait. We encourage them to have this, you know, they have a little relationship. And I think that's beautiful. That's what I want for them. So I hope that answers the question of like listening, knowing your child's heart. Don't compare. Never, ever, ever compare. Just relish in your child's uniqueness. Even if they're similarities, even if they both play basketball, they do it differently, you know? But also encourage them to have their own relationship without you. Mhm. So good. How do you teach kids to I mean is fight the right word fight respectfully or how do you respect. How do you teach them to respect. Respectfully disagree. That's a hot I feel like that's hard to teach. Mhm. I think that's when you get to come back into their situation and you say that's not acceptable. You can't talk to that person that way. And you get to be that. You're at the top of the pile. You get to be that person that says, no, we You're not doing that. No, we're not doing that. This is not the way we're doing this, you know, and I think don't be afraid. Go in there and say to the child, you can't you can't hit your sibling. You can't you can't call your sister or brother or name. You can't do any of that. And, you know, even when they were younger, I would say if you said something negative, you had to say three positives. It was always comical. And by the time they got to number three, which was a pathetic attempt sometimes just to repeat number one, because they really don't want to see anything positive. And then and, but it just lightens the mood, you know, and it helps them to see we're all human. We're not perfect. We're figuring this out. And you still get the love that person next to you. So I love it. That's so good. Okay, last piece of advice maybe that I want to hear from you right now. And I think this is going to be so wise. What is something now as you have adult children that for those of us who have younger kids that you maybe focused on too much, or you obsessed or worried too much that you wish. Now looking back, you would have maybe let go a little bit more and purely asking for all of us to say what is maybe something that we need to let go on that we're over fixated on. I think time, um, managing time and being overscheduled, I think I over focused on that. Um, but I also, I think a big piece of that that also comes to my mind is. Don't worry about messing up your children. I say that very loosely. It's I think too often we hear about adults who do not like how their parents parented. And I think we worry that we're going to create children that aren't going to like how we parented. Um, and that's okay, because you're not going to parent perfectly. And I would definitely say, you know, on the list of bad parenting skills, I may have pulled off a couple of them, you know, and I even knew what I was doing, but I still messed it up at times, you know? And I think it's, I think being too hard on yourself. Um, I think having the village that keeps you grounded really helps you to understand what you're doing and just not be so hard on yourself. Um, I feel like there could be more to that, but I just feel like that's like a big piece of it. And I and I, and I think enjoy every stage of children are at, you know, doesn't mean that you don't want to kick them through that stage. You know, there's been numerous times I'm like, ah, I know this is where they're at. But man, I can't wait till they get to the stage, you know, but enjoy every stage that they're at and that you're at. I think it's so incredibly important. But I also think it's important not to regret. I think if we spend too much time regretting, then we're not in the moment. Yeah. I think you really have some reason to regret, you know, if you really did mess something up, you should regret that. But I think even our conversation, a lot of what you're talking about in the big scheme of things, you're not going to remember that, you know, your son pushed somebody and that you yelled in the, in the, in the audience and and, you know, in the big scheme of things, you're not going to remember that. So I think just trying not to be too hard on yourself. Good answer. Okay. My favorite part of most of these interviews is the final lightning round question. And some of these you've already answered. So now I want to throw you some willy nilly. We'll see. We'll see if we can. You're so authentic. Anyway, Penny, I'm excited to see. Okay, so very first question, grandma or mom, what's been your favorite? All of the above. I know, I know, I know, it sounds so simple, but I love every stage that my children have been in and I would get my feathers ever so slightly ruffled when people would say, are you ready to be a grandma? Are you ready to be a grandma? I'm like, no. You know why? Because they're not ready to be parents. And when they're ready, I will be ready. And so, um, I love both of it, but I, I love I love being an aunt. I have had a significant role as an aunt in my life, and I feel like I love that. And, um, so I, I love every stage I'm in. I love I, I really, truly, truly do. Um, I enjoy watching my adult children be parents. It is the most phenomenal thing and, and I and I think it's equal to watching them do all of the little things that they did growing up. This is just another stage and I just get I'm so honored to be watching and part of their story. So that's a I mean that I mean that with all my heart. I don't want to sound cliche or anything, but really, I love every stage. Yeah. What would be a good book that you might suggest for parents to read is a good starting point for some. Some of the things that we talked about today. Oh good question. You know, I think find a good parenting, um, role model okay. It could be a book. It could be a, it could be somebody in your church. It could be somebody in your community. It could be your parent. Find somebody that could be like your mentor when it comes to parenting. Um, when I first started parenting, um, there was a parenting approach that was very cognitively based where I was all about learning and the choices you make. It was more that than feeling based. base still acknowledges feelings. And I and I think that that really shaped me as a parent. I still think that's wonderful. I don't even know if they still necessarily have books available on that. Um, but I also think when you don't, when you feel kind of stuck, reach out to somebody or get on the internet and start looking for some suggestions. And I think sometimes if you just kind of pull yourself away, it will make sense that your children will make sense. You will understand. And I and I think that that's so incredibly important. So I think I really believe people are the best answer. Just being with other people and getting your children to be with other people. I mean, I look at our kids now and they have amazing relationships with people who we brought into their lives because they are our friends now. They're their friends, too, even though there's, you know, generational issue there, an issue a generation different there. But, um, yeah, Just having other people in your children's lives, I think helps too. And it helps you. So I think everybody can be a good book. You just gotta look at it differently. Great job. Okay. Last question. What was a phrase that maybe you used too often, or maybe just as much as it needed to be used when the girls were growing up? As a parent, I know this is going to come as no shock. Are you ready? I'm ready. It's not about you. I said it all the time. It's not about you. It's not about you and what it is about you. It's about you. You know, so I think I said it as much that it's not about you. As I said, this is about you right now. This. We're doing this because it's about you right now. And I think that's probably the one I said the most. But I also I have a I'm not going to do it. I have a little embarrassing thing that I would do to encourage them to have confidence to increase and to go do whatever idea or event or activity or competition or whatever. I would do something that and I'm not going to do it, but, um, they would just kind of laugh. And I just have a little saying that I do when I'm doing my little is that a dad joke? It's kind of like, I don't know what it would be for a mom. It's just like, I would do it. And they're like, okay, mom, I get the point. I'm like, get in there and do this. You know, you got this, you know? And so I think just that confidence building, but probably it's not about you or guess what? This is all about you. You got this. So I think you got this or why not? You know, I think so often we try to come up with reasons why we shouldn't do something. I'm like, oh, let's come up with reasons why we should be doing it. Why not do it? Let's go. Spoken from a true gray area, Penny Edmondson, thank you so much for your time and your wisdom and your guidance through our conversation today. It's a true pleasure to get to live life with you in this way. And of course, we'll have show notes available for you to contact and reach out to Penny should you desire, but if you'd like to see her in person, she will be at Leadership Redefined here in Quincy on February twenty seventh. Penny, thank you so much and have a great rest of your day. You too. Thank you so much for including me, I appreciate it. It was fun. Go do these hard things that Penny tells us that we can. Yes. Amen. Thank you for listening to the Working Moms Redefined podcast. It is not lost on me that you chose to spend time together. Thank you. Let's connect outside of this space on socials. We'd love for you to follow us on Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, Pinterest. We've got it all to connect with you. If you feel as if someone in your life could be impacted by this message, feel free to share it. That is the biggest compliment as we part ways together. Remember, you can do hard things.
